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Ken Frazier and Ken Chenault are two gentlemen who managed to navigate corporate America like they were auditioning for a very serious game of corporate Survivor. Frazier, once a janitor’s son from Philadelphia, and Chenault, who became the third Black CEO of a Fortune 500 company, both have something in common: a knack for making it to the top while dodging an avalanche of systemic barriers that would make lesser mortals quiver in their loafers.

During a candid chat with CNN—because where else do you air your corporate grievances?—the two Kens grilled businesses that are playing fast and loose with diversity, equity, and inclusion (DEI) initiatives. Their argument? Failing to promote diversity is like ignoring that massive elephant in the room just so you can keep sipping your overpriced lattes.

In their words, abandoning DEI means kissing goodbye to future trailblazers like themselves. It’s sort of like throwing out the blueprint for your mansion just because you don’t like the colors. People might say, “But meritocracy!” to which Frazier and Chenault might respond, “Oh please, that’s just a fancy way of saying ‘old boys club.’”

This plea for diversity is increasingly echoing against a backdrop of political upheaval, where companies like John Deere and Harley-Davidson have decided that embracing DEI is just not worth the social media backlash. I mean, who wouldn’t want to ride the marketing rollercoaster that left Bud Light hanging on the brink of oblivion after they accidentally acknowledged a trans influencer? You can almost hear the sighs of relief as brands retreat back into their safe spaces—filled with bland board meetings instead of colorful discussions about inclusion.

Frazier, 69, and Chenault, 73, might be past their corporate glory days, but they’ve co-founded an organization called OneTen, aimed at creating a million careers for those without fancy degrees. Because let’s face it—understanding how to fill out a zero-calorie cupcake budget spreadsheet should never hold you back!

“At its best, DEI is like digging for buried cultural treasure—if you don’t go looking, you might just find yourself with nothing but rocks,” they explain. Businesses that ignore the talent hidden beneath the rubble of privilege are bound to be left sifting through a bunch of overpriced suits wondering why no one is buying the nonsense they’re selling.

DEI and Merit: The Sitcom

Not everyone is on board with DEI; cue the entrance of Elon Musk, who seems to have mistaken corporate diversity for a license to play “reverse racism.” Of course, he’s entitled to his opinion—as long as we all agree it’s worth its weight in irony.

According to Frazier and Chenault, there’s an amusing disconnect between those who espouse the “meritocratic” ideal and the historical reality that those with “merit” usually just happened to know someone—think close family ties or the odd country club invite. Because who really defined “merit” back in the day? Spoiler alert: it wasn’t the same folks fighting tooth and nail for a seat at the table today.

As COVID-19 ushered in a wave of DEI spending that made cash registers sing like a Broadway musical, we now witness some companies performing the “I didn’t mean it” tango after political pressures became more annoying than a salesperson on a perpetual follow-up. Frazier compares today’s political climate to a sine wave—a mathematical metaphor for whatever chaos we feel like drawing attention to today.

But don’t worry—just when you thought the diversity ship was going to sink under the weight of prejudice, some companies are sticking to their guns like an old cowboy in a Hollywood Western. Frazier notes that those companies that really, truly integrated DEI into their business practices won’t be swayed easily; they’ve marbled it into their corporate DNA much like how a kid sneaks broccoli into a brownie recipe.

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